EI/CE manhole history

Hi All,

I'm a new member to wiredawg.net and currently deployed to Afghanistan fullfilling a project engineer position. An interesting topic came up in a discussion regarding E&I history on the installation of manholes/manhole duct systems (MHDS). At one point in time E&I use to install manholes and duct systems and were really good at it. I recall as a young airman even being on jobs when we did this. Even now in tatical enviornments were installing them. But somewhere in the past civil engneering became responsible for this under real property and E&I was out of that business. Does anyone out there recall the year this happened and what documentation there is to support it.

Regards,

MSgt Howard "Bryce" Chance

Last duct system I can remember installing was in the early 90's.............E&I was naturally better at it since we were the ones who were going to use the ducts and knew what we wanted. Most Duct systems now days seem to be done through contracts, and somewhere in between what we want and what actually gets installed there is a breakdown of communications.

CE INSTALLED DUCT SYSTEMS, E&I ONLY DID IT FOR CERTAIN PROJECTS. REAL PROPERTY IS CE'S BAILIWICK.

219th installed the system at Forbes Field in the mid 90s. CE started but it was a cluster. CMSgt (now) Buckley was the cable team chief. He took over and completed it for the last 90%.

I agree with Donald, MH and Duct systems are considered as CE real property and should be installed by contractors under specific communication projects. Problem is, no one really knows how to install them anymore. Aligning duct banks and insuring the MH system is set up to drain properly is a benny. Proper height, ground rods, pulling in irons, and labeling the covers with "communications" also helps.

I was in E/I at McClellan AFB California from 89-97. The last project i worked on with MH and duct system was in 94 at Mountain Home. When the BRAC started to close the active E&I units, these type of installation started to slow down.

When I was in Korea in 1998, a guard team was doing CITS phase I, which included MH & duct system with fiber install.

When I got to Ramstein AB Germany in 1998, another guard team was finishing up with the CITS phase I install there. After that, any projects that the Communication Squadron Planning and Impamentaion flight generated which included MH & duct systems, was done mostly by contractor.

The only projects at that time and currently at that base which CE has anything to do with MH & duct systems other than maintaing, is with MILCON prjects. Currently any project that the Comm. SQ. generates, is done by contractor.

The 379th over in Al Udeid still installs the conduits and manholes, the Cable shop is augmented by contractors but they work together. The very few that CE did were not installed properly and they refuse to take responsibilty to get them repaired. There are more than 800 manholes there and the 379th takes care of them.

My experience

As a EIS member, we almost never installed manholes. I remember doing this once in my career.

In Korea for example, we contracted this works out to the locals and we where lefted with performing just light manhole work that involved adding ductwork, cable racks, neck-collars and covers. During my time stateside, we did the same again.

As a QA member, most manhole work was part of the SOW and installed by the primary telco contractor. In some cases they casted on site and other location it was better to pre-fab & carry to the drop point, and installed.

Much of Patrick AB was done this way, due to the sandy environment, and high water tables. And even due to the dumb turtle that would get confused and crawl it's way into the ecavation hole